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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Do lay people still take communion back home?
It's not something I've ever seen mentioned regarding modern times. In
answer to the argument that communion was "always" on the tongue, there is ample
evidence from the Church Fathers that communion was taken home by laity for sick
people - before communion on the tongue became the norm. In the East, it's
given by spoon, which many in the West have considered to be contrary to "Take
and eat ... take and drink."</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I don't think the words used when the priest gives
out communion are really such an important issue - I showed 3 different forms
(old Roman, new Roman, Byzantine).</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>If we look at tha baptismal formula, there are two
standard forms - "<EM>I baptise you ...</EM>" and "<EM>You are baptised
...</EM>" Western Catholics use the former, and Eastern Catholics and
Orthodox use the latter. All consider both to be valid.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>If we look at the bread used, only the Romans,
Maronites, Armenians (Orthodox and Catholic) use unleavened bread - all the rest
in the Catholic and Orthodox world use leavened bread. Today the customs
exist happily side by side; in the past it was an issue to fight
over.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Of far greater concern is the order of the
Eucharistic Prayer - and prior to 1500, the Mozarabic rite didn't have a formal
Eucharistic Prayer, and was flexible, and only after 1500 were the words of
institution (<EM>This is my Body ... This is my Blood</EM>) even required.
Even there, there is no agreement on when the bread and wine become the Body and
Blood of Christ. In the West, there is agreement (but not a formal
definition) that it occurs with the words of institution, which, on their
own, are considered to constitute the necessary and sufficient sacramental form
of the Eucharist, and my understanding is that transubstantiation is therefore
completed here also; in the East (Catholic and Orthodox) there is agreement that
it is completed with the epiclesis (which comes after the words of institution
in the Byzantine and Tridentine rites, but prior to the words of consecration in
the current ordinary form.) Both points of view exist happily side by side
in the Catholic Church united by the Pope.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>So to an Eastern Catholic, if the epiclesis comes
before the words of institution, the bread and wine are already transformed into
the Body and Blood of Christ by the time the Latin priest says "<EM>On the night
he was betrayed</EM>" (the form used in the current ordinary rite, and the
Eastern rites) or "<EM>On the day before he suffered</EM>" (in the Tridentine
Mass.) The epiclesis therefore is placed in a rather strange positon in
the current ordinary rite for Easterners, and in the Tridentine and Eastern
rites, after the words of institution, which it more comfortable for both
sides.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Ironically, however "essential" the words of
institution (<EM>This is my Body ... This is my Blood</EM>) may be for the
Roman-rite Catholics, they ARE dispensable in some cases - the Holy Qurbana of
Addai and Mari omits them, and Rome has accepted this as a valid liturgy used by
Catholics today. The reasoning: "<EM>the words of the institution of the
Eucharist are in fact present in the anaphora of Addai and Mari, not in the form
of a coherent narration and in a literal way but in a eucological and
disseminated manner, that is to say they are integrated in the prayers of
thanksgiving, praise and intercession which follow.</EM>" [Pontifical
Council for Promoting Christian Unity, Guidelines for Admission to the Eucharist
Between the Chaldean Church and the Assyrian Church of the East, July 20,
2001.]</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#008000 size=2>Words of institution in green
<U>[Underlined section = the only audible words from the priest in the Anaphora
(Eucharistic Prayer) in the Liturgy of St John Chrysostom.]</U></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#ff0000 size=2>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#800080 size=2>Anamnesis in
purple</FONT></DIV>Epiclesis in red</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>When the Real Presence becomes
present in blue</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Note the sequence:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><FONT color=#ff0000>Epiclesis</FONT>, <FONT
color=#008000>words of institution</FONT>, <FONT color=#800080>anamnesis</FONT>
= current Mass</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><FONT color=#008000>Words of institution</FONT>,
<FONT color=#800080>anamnesis</FONT>, <FONT color=#ff0000>epiclesis</FONT> =
Eastern and Tridentine Mass</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><STRONG>In other words, the following is the order
of our current Mass [Eucharistic Prayer II] -</STRONG> </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><FONT color=#ff0000>Lord, you are holy indeed, the
fountain of all holiness. Let your Spirit come upon these gifts to make them
holy, so that they may become for us the body and blood of our Lord, Jesus
Christ. </FONT><FONT color=#0000ff>[This is where the bread and wine become the
Body and Blood for Eastern Catholics and Orthodox]</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#008000 size=2>Before he was given up to death, a
death he freely accepted, he took bread and gave you thanks, He broke the bread,
gave it to his disciples, and said:<BR>Take this, all of you, and eat
it;<BR>this is my body which will be given up for you.<BR>When the supper was
ended, he took the cup. Again he gave you thanks and praise, gave the cup to his
disciples, and said:<BR>Take this, all of you, and drink from it;<BR>this is the
cup of my blood, the blood of the new and everlasting covenant. It will be shed
for you and for all so that sins may be forgiven. Do this in memory of
me.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>[This is where the bread and wine
become the Body and Blood for Western Catholics]</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#800080 size=2>In memory of his death and
resurrection, we offer you, Father, this life-giving bread, this saving cup. We
thank you for counting us worthy to stand in your presence and serve you. May
all of us who share in the body and blood of Christ be brought together in unity
by the Holy Spirit.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><STRONG>In the Eastern and Tridentine Masses, the
order is as follows [Liturgy of St John Chrysostom] -</STRONG></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#008000 size=2>Priest (inaudibly): Having come and
having fulfilled the divine plan for us, on the night when He was delivered up,
or rather gave Himself up for the life of the world, He took bread in His holy,
pure and blameless hands, gave thanks, blessed and sanctified it and, breaking
it, gave it to His holy disciples and apostles, saying:<BR>Priest (aloud):
<U>Take, eat, this is my body which is broken for you for the remission of
sins.<BR></U>Priest (in a low voice): Likewise, after supper, He took the cup,
saying:<BR>Priest (aloud): <U>Drink of this all of you; this is my blood of the
New Covenant, which is shed for you and for many for the remission of
sins.</U></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>[This is where the bread and wine
become the Body and Blood for Western Catholics]</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#ff0000 size=2><FONT color=#800080>Priest
(inaudibly): Remembering therefore this saving commandment, and all that came to
pass for our sake, the cross, the tomb, the resurrection on the third day, the
ascension into heaven, the enthronement at the right hand, and the second and
glorious coming.</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#ff0000 size=2><FONT
color=#800080>...</FONT><BR>Priest: Offering You these gifts from Your own
gifts, in all and for all. We praise You, we bless You, we give thanks to You,
and we pray to You, Lord our God.<BR>Priest (in a low voice): Once again we
offer to You this spiritual worship without the shedding of blood, and we ask,
pray and entreat You: send down Your Holy Spirit upon us and upon these gifts
here offered.<BR>Deacon: Father, bless the holy bread.<BR>Priest: And make this
bread the precious Body of Your Christ. Amen.<BR>Deacon: Father, bless the holy
cup.<BR>Deacon: Father, bless them both.<BR>Priest: Changing them by Your Holy
Spirit. Amen. Amen. Amen.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>[This is where the bread and wine
become the Body and Blood for Eastern Catholics and Orthodox]</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><STRONG>In the Eastern and Tridentine Masses, the
order is as follows [Tridentine Mass] -</STRONG></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#008000 size=2>Qui, pridie quam pateretur, accepit
panem in sanctas ac venerabiles manus suas, et elevatis oculis in caelum ad te
Deum Patrem suum omnipotentem, tibi gratias agens benedixit, fregit, deditque
discipulis suis, dicens: Accipite et manducate ex hoc omnes: hoc est enim Corpus
meum, quod pro vobis tradetur. <EM>(Who, on the day before his Passion, took
bread in his holy venerable hands, and looking up to heaven to you, God, his
almighty Father, giving you thanks, he blessed it, broke it, and gave it to his
disciples, saying: Take, all of you, and eat of it: for this is my Body, which
will be given up for you).</EM></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#008000 size=2>Simili modo, postquam cenatum est,
accipiens et hunc praeclarum calicem in sanctas ac venerabiles manus suas, item
tibi gratias agens benedixit, deditque discipulis suis, dicens: Accipite et
bibite ex eo omnes: his est enim calix Sanguinis mei novi et aeterni testamenti,
qui pro vobis et pro multis effundetur in remissionem peccatorum. Hoc facite in
meam commemorationem. <EM>(Similarly, when supper was ended, taking also this
magnificent chalice in his holy venerable hands, giving you thanks in like
manner, he blessed it, and gave it to his disciples, saying: Take this, all of
you, and drink from it: for this is the cup of my Blood of the new and eternal
testament, which will be shed for you and for the many for the forgiveness of
sins. Do this in memory of me.)</EM></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>[This is where the bread and wine
become the Body and Blood for Western Catholics]</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#800080 size=2>Unde et memores, Domine, nos servi
tui, sed et plebs tua sancta, eiusdem Christi, Filii tui, Domini nostri, tam
beatae passionis, necnon et ab inferis resurrectionis, sed et in caelos
gloriosae ascensionis: offerimus praeclarae maiestati tuae de tuis donis ac
datis hostiam puram, hostiam sanctam, hostiam immaculatam, Panem sanctum vitae
aeternae et Calicem salutis perpetuae. <EM>(Therefore, Lord, we your servants,
and also your holy people, mindful of the so blessed passion of the same Christ,
your Son, our Lord, and of his resurrection from the world beneath and his
glorious ascension to heaven, offer to your exalted majesty, from what you have
bestowed and given, a pure victim, a holy victim, a stainless victim, the holy
Bread of eternal life and the Chalice of perpetual salvation).</EM></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#ff0000 size=2>Supplices te rogamus, omnipotens
Deus, iube haec perferri per manus sancti Angeli tui in sublime altare tuum, in
conspectu divinae maiestatis tuae; ut quotquot ex hac altaris participatione
sacrosanctum Filii tui Corpus et Sanguinem sumpserimus, omni benedictione
caelesti et gratia repleamur. (Per Christum Dominum nostrum. Amen) <EM>(We
suppliantly beg you, almighty God, bid them to be brought by the hands of your
holy Angel to your altar on high, in the sight of your divine majesty, so that
as many of us as will, by this participation of the altar, receive the sacred
Body and Blood of your Son may be filled with every heavenly blessing and grace.
[Through Christ our Lord. Amen]).</EM></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>[This is where the bread and wine
become the Body and Blood for Eastern Catholics and Orthodox]</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>And then there is the issue of whether the
epiclesis is an invocation of the Holy Spirit (current Roman norm, Orthodox),
the Father (Tridentine Mass, which requires correction to invoke the Holy
Spirit for Orthodox use) or Christ (I found one while reading up for
yesterday's post.)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>So my conclusion is that there are far greater
things to worry about than the words used to give communion.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Depending on the priest, Mass at the local
cathedral may or may not include the creed, and communion is often enough by
self-intinction with the chalice left standing on the altar, and the priest
giving the Host. Those are far bigger concerns.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>God bless,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Stephen</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=rcdianne@yahoo.com href="mailto:rcdianne@yahoo.com">Dianne Dawson</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=arthurkelly@yahoo.com
href="mailto:arthurkelly@yahoo.com">Art Kelly</A> ; <A
title=apologetics@gathman.org
href="mailto:apologetics@gathman.org">Apologetics Group</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, August 22, 2007 7:43
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Apologetics] Re: From
NewAdvent.org newsletter</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>He also substantiated that at least as far back as the sixth century the
words of the priest were not a simple "The Body of Christ." So how far
back is far enough? Why go back to the beginning for parts of the Mass
and not others. If you take part of the Mass back to the earliest times
then you need to take the whole Mass back. If we do that then Communion
is not received at EVERY Mass. Also, ordinary people can take Communion
back to their homes to distribute to other people. How far
back would you purpose going back and are you willing to accept ALL of
the changes that would entail (remember that the Mass would not be in
English).</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Dianne<BR><BR><B><I>Art Kelly <arthurkelly@yahoo.com></I></B>
wrote:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">You
will note that Stephen substantiated my statement<BR>that the distribution
of Communion in the current rite<BR>of the Mass is authentic to the early
Chruch, while<BR>the Tridentine rite is NOT:<BR><BR>In early times the words
used by the priest in giving<BR>Holy Communion were, for the species of
bread, "Corpus<BR>Christi" "the body of Christ" - to which the
receiver<BR>answered, "Amen."<BR><BR>If you need further proof from other
authoratative<BR>sources, please let me know.<BR><BR>Art<BR><BR>--- Dianne
Dawson <RCDIANNE@YAHOO.COM>wrote:<BR><BR>> Stephen,<BR>> <BR>>
Thank you for the wonderful and extensive<BR>> explanation.<BR>>
<BR>> Dianne<BR>> <BR>> Stephen Korsman
<SKORSMAN@THEOTOKOS.CO.ZA>wrote:<BR>> Hi<BR>> <BR>> Well, there
were quiet moments, but the church was<BR>> a very small one, and very
well designed<BR>> accoustically, even though it was quite a
primitive<BR>> building, being very rural. It was a Latin-rite<BR>>
building; the congregation was mixed religion<BR>> because there were no
Orthodox priests in the area -<BR>> this was their visiting Catholicos
from India. So<BR>> most could be heard; and the clouds of incense
were<BR>> thick, but didn't mask the view - not quite.<BR>> <BR>>
In terms of not hearing what the priest does, the<BR>> Byzantines are
worse - you don't even see the priest<BR>> during the consecration. I've
never been to their<BR>> liturgies, but there are plenty of bracketed
"(in a<BR>> low voice)" statements throughout the copy of the<BR>>
Liturgy of St John Chrysostom I have. I've put it<BR>> in my Google Docs
-<BR>> http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=d46kfgg_33frr86j ... I<BR>> have
a nice PDF in Greek and English if anyone wants<BR>> it.<BR>> <BR>>
Regarding the words said by the priest when<BR>> communion was received,
I've done a bit of<BR>> searching, and can only find the following (on
the<BR>> Melkite Catholic site) - <BR>> <BR>> In early times the
words used by the priest in<BR>> giving Holy Communion were, for the
species of<BR>> bread, "Corpus Christi" "the body of Christ" - to<BR>>
which the receiver answered, "Amen"; and for the<BR>> species of wine,
"Sanguis Christi poculum Saluti" -<BR>> "The Blood of Christ, the cup of
Salvation" - to<BR>> which "Amen" was also answered. About the time
of<BR>> Pope Gregory the Great (Sixth century) the form had<BR>>
changed into "Corpus Domini nostri Jesu Christi<BR>> conservet animam
tuam" - "May the Body or our Lord<BR>> Jesus Christ preserve your soul" -
to which the<BR>> receiver would respond, as before "Amen." With<BR>>
Alcuin, preceptor of Charlemagne, we find the form,<BR>> "May the Body of
Our Lord Jesus Christ preserve you<BR>> unto life everlasting."<BR>> -
http://www.melkite.org/HolyCommunion.html<BR>> <BR>> Corpus Domini
nostri Jesu Christi custodiat animam<BR>> meam in vitam aeternam. Amen. -
Tridentine Mass,<BR>> Pius V onwards (1570 Missals onwards)<BR>> -
Cologne Missal (1525 AD)<BR>> - Missale Romanum (1474 AD)<BR>> -
Missale Bracarense (pre-1570 AD)<BR>> <BR>> Corpus et sanguis Domini
nostri Jesu Christi<BR>> custodiat corpus meam in vitam eternam.
Amen.<BR>> - Mozarabic Missal (1500 AD, in it's most recent<BR>> form,
as far as I can work out, but dates to the<BR>> 7th/8th centuries) (I
presume that they intinct, or<BR>> that this refers to the priest
only.)<BR>> - Dominican Missal (1267 AD)<BR>> <BR>> Parts of the
Mozarabic Mass on video, which I<BR>> cannot differentiate from the
Tridentine Mass,<BR>> having never been to either:<BR>>
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tXl5yMxwZU<BR>>
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_UbhqEwxao<BR>> <BR>> In the Stowe
Missal (750 AD, Celtic, using<BR>> leavened bread, unlike the Latin
rite), the<BR>> communicant says "Amen":<BR>> [The Celebrant
administers the Body and Blood<BR>> from the Paten, saying:]<BR>>
[From the Sacrament of Baptism:<BR>> May the Body and Blood of our Lord
Jesus Christ be<BR>> to thee unto life eternal.<BR>> R. Amen.]<BR>>
[Or, from the Sacrament of Unction:<BR>> May the Body and Blood of our
Lord Jesus Christ, the<BR>> Son of the living and<BR>> most high God,
be to thee unto life eternal.<BR>> R. Amen.]<BR>> [The Chalice is
administered with the words:<BR>> May the Blood of our Lord Jesus Christ
be to thee<BR>> unto life eternal.<BR>> R. Amen.<BR>> Priest:
Corpus Christ<BR>> Response: Amen<BR>> - Ambrosian Missal (not sure of
the date, but<BR>> suppression of the rite was attempted in
1060.)<BR>> <BR>> And most different of all, the text of the
Divine<BR>> Liturgy of St John Chrysostom has the following:<BR>> The
servant of God (Name) receives the Body and<BR>> Blood of Christ for
forgiveness of sins and eternal<BR>> life.<BR>> <BR>> God
bless,<BR>> Stephen<BR>> ----- Original Message ----- <BR>> From:
Art Kelly <BR>> To: Apologetics Group <BR>> Sent: Tuesday, August 21,
2007 4:47 PM<BR>> Subject: Re: [Apologetics] Re: From
NewAdvent.org<BR>> newsletter<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> Stephen,<BR>>
<BR>> Did the celebrant turn his back to the congregation<BR>> and
speak in a deliberately low voice so no one<BR>> could<BR>> see or
hear what was happening on the altar?<BR>> <BR>> Art<BR>> <BR>>
--- Stephen Korsman <SKORSMAN@THEOTOKOS.CO.ZA><BR>> wrote:<BR>>
<BR>> > Hi<BR>> > ----- Original Message ----- <BR>> >
From: Dianne Dawson <BR>> > To: Art Kelly ; Apologetics Group <BR>>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2007 12:43 AM<BR>> > Subject: Re:
[Apologetics] Re: From<BR>> NewAdvent.org<BR>> > newsletter<BR>>
> <BR>> > <BR>> > If someone had never been to a Mass (in
any<BR>> > language) then that one might fly, otherwise it's<BR>>
a<BR>> > weak argument. If you were traveling out of the<BR>> >
country would you avoid going to Mass just because<BR>> > you didn't
understand every word the priest spoke?<BR>> <BR>> > I doubt it
because you are familiar with the<BR>> format<BR>> > and what is
happening and when. Actually, that is<BR>> > one of the best reason to
have the Mass in Latin. <BR>> > There I must agree. I've been to a
Novus Ordo<BR>> Latin<BR>> > Mass, which was quite comprehendable
even though I<BR>> > only had 2 years of school Latin at the time.
<BR>> I've<BR>> > been to Mass in Swazi, which I don't understand
at<BR>> > all, but I knew what was going on. I've even to a<BR>>
> Malakaran Orthodox service, which is not like<BR>> ours,<BR>>
> but Eastern rite, and they have their Catholic<BR>> >
equivalents. Even there, I could follow, even<BR>> > though it was a
rite I'd never been to, and in a<BR>> > language I'd never
heard.<BR>> > <BR>> > God bless,<BR>> > Stephen<BR>>
> --<BR>> > Stephen Korsman<BR>> >
skorsman@theotokos.co.za<BR>> > The Theotokos Website<BR>> > A
Rural Virologist || RSS feed<BR>> > Sabbath Keepers || RSS
feed<BR>> > <BR>> > IC | XC<BR>> > ---------<BR>> >
NI | KA<BR>> > <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> ART KELLY, ATM-S<BR>>
13524 Brightfield Lane<BR>> Herndon, Virginia 20171-3360<BR>> (703)
904-3763 home<BR>> (703) 396-6956 work<BR>>
arthurkelly@yahoo.com<BR>> art.kelly@cox.net<BR>>
ArtK135@Netscape.net<BR>> <BR>> <BR>>
<BR>><BR>____________________________________________________________________________________<BR>>
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http://bmsi.com/mailman/listinfo/apologetics<BR>> <BR>> <BR>>
<BR>> Like a deer that longs for running waters so my soul<BR>> longs
for you, O God.<BR>> <BR>> Ps 42:1<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> <BR>>
<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> ---------------------------------<BR>> Need a
vacation? Get great deals to amazing places<BR>> on Yahoo! Travel.
<BR><BR><BR>ART KELLY, ATM-S<BR>13524 Brightfield Lane<BR>Herndon, Virginia
20171-3360<BR>(703) 904-3763 home<BR>(703) 396-6956
work<BR>arthurkelly@yahoo.com<BR>art.kelly@cox.net<BR>ArtK135@Netscape.net<BR><BR><BR><BR>____________________________________________________________________________________Ready
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list<BR>Apologetics@gathman.org<BR>http://bmsi.com/mailman/listinfo/apologetics<BR><BR><!DSPAM:1148BC0BD0A31172505418253><BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR><BR>
<DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#0000bf><EM><FONT face="comic sans ms">
<DIV><EM><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#0000bf>Like a deer that longs
for running waters so my soul longs for you, O
God.</FONT></EM></DIV></FONT></EM></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#0000bf><EM><FONT face="comic sans ms">Ps
42:1</FONT></EM></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><EM><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#0000bf
size=1></FONT></EM> </DIV>
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