[Apologetics] Purgatory is key issue

[Stephen Korsman]

Hi

Anti-Catholics tend to view the Jesuits as a sinister force doing the evil 
work of the Pope.  Catholics who don't like the Jesuits tend to view them as 
ultra-liberal theologians.  I can understand that somewhat - we had a few 
Jesuit priests once, and they decried various miracles in the Bible, 
explained away a lot of what Jesus did as myth, and got quite a few people 
upset.  The one day I even wondered whether or not the priest believed in 
God as more than the power of love between humans.  On the other hand, I've 
come across many orthodox Jesuits.  Avery Cardinal Dulles would be an 
orthodox one, but having a Secretary of State as a father and a CIA director 
as an uncle may have brought on some conspiracy claims about him, although 
that's just my suspicion - I haven't heard of any.

Wikipedia says "Within the Catholic Church, some Jesuits are criticized by 
some parties for allegedly being overly liberal and allegedly deviating 
substantially from official Church teaching and papal directives, especially 
on such issues as abortion, priestly celibacy, homosexuality, and liberation 
theology."

It also says "The Jesuits have frequently been described by their enemies 
(both Catholic and Protestant) as engaged in various conspiracies." - but I 
haven't come across Catholic conspiracy theorists claiming this.

God bless,
Stephen


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Art Kelly" <arthurkelly at yahoo.com>
To: "Apologetics Group" <apologetics at gathman.org>
Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2008 9:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Apologetics] Purgatory is key issue


> It's funny, but many pro-Catholic apologists have much
> worse opinions of the Jesuits than do anti-Catholic
> apologists.
>
> Art
>
> --- Stephen Korsman <skorsman at theotokos.co.za> wrote:
>
>> Hi
>>
>> > They could reasonably claim that I am
>> mis-representing the Catholic
>> > position (and I have gotten that on occasion -
>> those Catholics are tricky,
>> > they pretend to use words in a different way just
>> to deceive you!).
>>
>> That's something I've had a lot of.  Especially with
>> purgatory, and
>> worshipping Mary.  It's because of that that I've
>> been accused of being a
>> Jesuit spy, and other laughable things.  Often
>> they'll find a website that
>> uses the word "worship" or claims that we atone for
>> our sins, and won't
>> acknowledge that the use of the words "worship" and
>> "atone" are not used in
>> their way.
>>
>> God bless,
>> Stephen
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Stuart D. Gathman" <stuart at gathman.org>
>> To: <apologetics at gathman.org>
>> Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2008 4:57 PM
>> Subject: [Apologetics] Purgatory is key issue
>>
>>
>> >I think the purgatory issue is the key to ending
>> the Catholic and
>> >Evangelical straw-man massacre.  Evangelicals will
>> repeat the doctrine of
>> >purgatory over and over again in their own words,
>> but continue to denounce
>> >the Catholic doctrine - even when presented with
>> the same vocabulary! There
>> >really is a suspension of reason.  They could
>> reasonably claim that I am
>> >mis-representing the Catholic position (and I have
>> gotten that on
>> >occasion - those Catholics are tricky, they pretend
>> to use words in a
>> >different way just to deceive you!).  But instead
>> there is a cognitive
>> >dissonance with affirming a doctrine when
>> attributed to Evangelicals, but
>> >denouncing the same doctrine with same words and
>> same scriptures when
>> >attributed to Catholics.  Amazing.  They really
>> believe that "all Catholic
>> >doctrines are unbiblical - even the ones I agree
>> with".  Pressing on the
>> >contradiction tends to make them prefer heresy (God
>> never disciplines true
>> >believers) to admitting that they might agree with
>> Catholics on just a few
>> >points.
>> >
>> > Sugarman just hit me a slow high return just
>> asking for a slam dunk:
>> > "The bottom line is if no doctrine can be back up
>> by scripture then its
>> > not true."  Boy could I have fun with that.  But
>> I'll restrain myself.
>> > I'll just lament with the Professor in Narnia:
>> "Logic!  What do they teach
>> > in schools these days?"  It may be that
>> apologetics is useless without an
>> > introductory logic course first.  It may be better
>> to just quote a few
>> > scriptures and leave it alone.
>> >
>> > -- 
>> >        Stuart D. Gathman <stuart at bmsi.com>
>> > Business Management Systems Inc.  Phone: 703
>> 591-0911 Fax: 703 591-6154
>> > "Confutatis maledictis, flamis acribus addictis" -
>> background song for
>> > a Microsoft sponsored "Where do you want to go
>> from here?" commercial.
>> > _______________________________________________
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>> >
>>
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>
>
> ART KELLY, ATM-S
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